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Starting February 1st ALL new Exiern pages will post ONLY to Exiern.com and Our Patreon. Please read and support us there!
Swords, Sorcery, And Then Some!
Howdy, New Readers! Thanks for reading Exiern!
Written by Scott T. Hicken with art by Antipus, the comic updates Mondays. Please check out the Archive to enjoy the earlier adventures of Typh and Peonie!
Exiern contains mature themes and is best for readers 18+.
Here’s a theoretical question for everyone, I know it couldn’t be done right now anyway because they’d need to finance it and find someone to do it but I was wondering what people think.
I’ve run this webcomic past a few people I know and their feedback is that the opening segments really aren’t their thing (I personally like it very much). Now the style of the comic is quite different in tone, would it be worth one day doing a condensed version retelling the entire Drowemos section but more in the style and tone of the present day comic.
Because that’s also another thing, there’s a lot of back archive that not everyone I know wants to read to get up to speed at this time. Would it be worth having that condensed version which is more tonally consistent with the present and from there people could read and then go straight to Chemiclord’s arc.
I would imagine only doing this as part of a combined effort to push the advertising of the webcomic to bring in more readers and hopefully more Patreon donors as well.
How many pages of a condensed retelling would be enough? 8, 16, 24, 32, other amount?
Part 46 onwards will require at least $1/month via Patreon (It’s called part 54 because the original numbering system included filler pages but it’s actually the 46th page of actual story).
The problem with the first arc is that it’s done as NSFW and the naughty bits painted over or overlaid with speech bubbles for non-payers. So re-doing a condensed version of that in the current SFW style would be a nice idea. But worth it? I fear there’s a little too much to do and it’s a little too late.
I wasn’t thinking so much about the nature of the artwork, I was thinking about reconfiguring the style and the tone of a summarised retelling to fit with how the story is now, still some humour but an overall serious theme.
Possibly part of the problem is now that people start the story and the way it isn’t to their liking and they never get to the more recent stuff which might be more their thing and give up before that.
I mean, concerning the unicorn, we went from this:
(it’s a lot more profound and weighty look at the situation).
Also, I wouldn’t think it would be worth doing on its own but as part of a push to get more readers and especially Patreon donors, combine it with a big advertising push in all the right places.
It’d be a lot like Doctor Who, almost no-one of us are ever going to leap in at the absolute very beginning, everyone picks a start point to go forward from, they always can work backwards later. So have one link with the summarised form in the present style of story telling (more serious) in however many pages to get the basics across (10, 20, 30) and another for everything if they want to go back and look at it.
I guess that’s the other thing, you’d want to hook people in to the story as it’s being told *now* as well, maybe this way would help? Obviously I’m just theorising here as a thought experiment for now.
@Shan
“Retellings” of the art pre-Shipeng have been floated, and they usually break down into two categories;
1) Short summaries that we would include in the beginning of the TPBs (if we ever get final approvals) that cover what came before (although it has also been floated to do this in the Chibiern style).
2) Retelling the entire comic in monthly “issue-sized” chunks for republisher sites such as Comixology, which could even be printed and sold. This is usually toyed with under the title of “Exiern: The Cleave Age.”
Some of this doesn’t get done because I don’t want to appear to be wiping out Exiern’s history – I greatly dislike DC Comic’s various reboots for doing just that (even though the original pages would remain posted). But ultimately, like all things Exiern, much of it has come down to deciding if we want to do that or publish another page of the main story.
But it is a concept I’ve been working on and will probably happen in the future.
Just a theoretical exercise on my part for fun. I would never call for rewriting the past, just a discussion about the benefit of having an additional condensed version as an alternate version to help people jump onboard (it’s a problem I’m having with people I’m recommending it to), like how people get into Doctor as opposed to watching every single surviving episode to the present day (they get the Cliff notes somehow).
It’s not just the amount, it’s just that it’s all a completely different style and tone to the present day. I really like all of it despite its differences (in fact because of its differences).
Anyway, it’s all going to be theoretical (which is why I put it here instead of messaging it to you) for now as even I understand that these things take time and cost money and for now, that’s better spent pushing the existing story forward. It was just a fun exercise for me as to wondering how to do it in conjunction with a plan to get more readers.
By the way, anyone else read this webcomic? It’s kind of in the same ballpark as this one (Warning, is adult rated NSFW) and I was wondering what anyone else thought. It’s amazingly well done and I think it really deserves as much support as possible. The art and story are fantastic IMO.
It’s really good. I had to read it several times to work out who was who and what was going on but that’s probably just because I’m stupid (it’s not actually that hard to follow). Also I didn’t mind, it was fun reading it over and over again (picked up more each time) and it’s packed full of detail and excellent characters and dialogue. There’s a 125 pages so far so it hopefully will tide you over until next week.
It’s a shame his Patreon isn’t doing a lot better given the amount of work he puts into it but they told me that due to the content being R-rated (and unavoidably being self declared as NSFW to them), people can only pay Patreon via credit card and not Paypal (Paypal’s terms of service won’t let them). I’m guessing that unavoidably puts a big squeeze on people paying him unfortunately.
I read Eternal Knights, and find to hard to follow, which obviously puts me in the ‘stupider than you’ category 😉 but I still read it because the art is fascinating. I particularly love the facial expressions, which the author gets from looking at himself in the mirror (his face must be very malleable).
As for the other topic, I’d prefer the comic to go forward as is, without worrying about the past. I have considered deleting my old work many times, but every time my fans (all three of them) tell me “don’t you dare, deleting them, Dad!” I mean, “Author that is not related to us in any way”!
You already have starting points people can choose if having a four-figure archive is a problem for them. To others, like me, the longer archive is an attraction.
I was never saying delete anything, just have something like a button marked “First 500 pages” or whatever and another saying “Abridged Version (50 pages) then go to etc to continue” for the people who want to both start from a later arc but at least a rundown of what happened before (it’s a bit hard to start Chemiclord’s story without at least a bit of background). Anyway, it’s all hypothetical because it’s not happening anytime soon and I don’t need it as I liked all the early stuff too.
As for Eternal Knights …
I think it’ll help once he has the time and money to colour it. It was designed to be in colour and that really helps when you see the pages he’s already done, it’s easier to pick out detail when it’s not in monochrome.
Yes, I agree it takes at least a bit of work to get through it, the panels are stuffed with detail everywhere but each time I went through it I picked up a bit more (rereading it again right now actually) and the good part is, I actually think it was worth it (certainly beats having to reread something you don’t like).
The characters in it certainly form a very connected web, that also took a bit of time to work out who was connected to whom and how but that was also fun once I got it. Well most of it, there’s still one or two elements I’m not quite sure where they exactly fit.
You’re right about the art, he is good, isn’t he? I certainly would be interested on his take of the characters here.
I don’t think your intelligence has anything to do with your difficulty following Eternal Knights. I tried following EK for a while—the artwork for EK is brilliant—but only a short while. It’s simply not worth the effort. The problem is simply that the writing is awful. The plot line is a complete mess, the characters’ motivations make no sense, and the dialogue could have been better written by a nine-year-old. There are just too many good webcomics around to be wasting my time on junk like EK.
Hey all, I never mind people sharing comics links that they think readers will enjoy. And some discussion is also totally cool. However, if we’re going to go too deep or critical into any subject that isn’t Exiern related I’d ask that the conversation move somewhere better suited and related to the topic. Thanks!
I went back to its beginning when I began reading this web comic, as I have done with others I found. it definitely gives a fuller sense of enjoyment to have some basis for moving forward, rather than jumping into the middle and going “huh?” at some turn of events. But most can be figured out sooner or later, even if you do not go back to the beginning. I appreciate that this one is still going. Some have faded away.
What I try not to do- is overthink any web ‘comic’. Unless it truly is setting out to make moral, ethical, political, social or any other purposeful commentary as the main function of its publication, and says so, I just enjoy the story and where it is taking the reader in the universe it built. There is some suspension of reality in all of these.
Why can’t we just enjoy it as it is, without a lot of ruminating on deeper meanings. It may mean something totally different to each person, and to me- that is one of the wonderful things about this genre, and especially this comic. As it has changed and evolved through different creators, it still retains the basic elements it had. It is enjoyable to see the evolution and appreciate what the creative forces behind it have molded.
On the subject of backstory: it would help to have a proper archive page, or maybe a wiki. Something that links to all the comic pages and divides them by story arc.
@Eric: If you look closely, you can see their faces in profile, though apparently cloaked in magical shadow. In any case, you can tell that their mouths are accessible for drinking purposes.
@T’Renn: Oh yeah, okay I see it now, in the first panel that is visible for the guy on the right in particular. Still looks like the guy on the left is going to pour it down the front of his armour. 🙂 I think that’s probably either a perspective issue, or the cup was just drawn too low.
Be a Producer!Your name/title with an optional SFW hyperlink will be posted prominently HERE following the close of the month! You’ll also receive monthly mailings from Exiern’s author, Scott T. Hicken!
…I want to see if the King joins them…
Here’s a theoretical question for everyone, I know it couldn’t be done right now anyway because they’d need to finance it and find someone to do it but I was wondering what people think.
I’ve run this webcomic past a few people I know and their feedback is that the opening segments really aren’t their thing (I personally like it very much). Now the style of the comic is quite different in tone, would it be worth one day doing a condensed version retelling the entire Drowemos section but more in the style and tone of the present day comic.
Because that’s also another thing, there’s a lot of back archive that not everyone I know wants to read to get up to speed at this time. Would it be worth having that condensed version which is more tonally consistent with the present and from there people could read and then go straight to Chemiclord’s arc.
I would imagine only doing this as part of a combined effort to push the advertising of the webcomic to bring in more readers and hopefully more Patreon donors as well.
How many pages of a condensed retelling would be enough? 8, 16, 24, 32, other amount?
Rolling a cannon ball towards a bunch of upside-down clubs in an attempt to knock all of them over? Sounds like fun. ^_^
By the way, who’s seen the new Dark Reflections page? That’s one hell of a scary waist to hip ratio that Tiffany’s got there don’t you think?
@Archone: The king is probably busy at the moment.
Anyway, glad Typhan-Knee found some common ground with the guards and that his night ended on a good note. He deserves it.
I can never remember how to find Dark Reflections. Anyone have a link to the latest?
http://extra.exiern.com/comic/dark-reflections-00/
Will get you the first 45 parts.
Part 46 onwards will require at least $1/month via Patreon (It’s called part 54 because the original numbering system included filler pages but it’s actually the 46th page of actual story).
The problem with the first arc is that it’s done as NSFW and the naughty bits painted over or overlaid with speech bubbles for non-payers. So re-doing a condensed version of that in the current SFW style would be a nice idea. But worth it? I fear there’s a little too much to do and it’s a little too late.
At least Typh has reacquired her/his taste for beer. And now the brothers are taking her on a bowling date. Such gentlemen.
@ Quentin
I wasn’t thinking so much about the nature of the artwork, I was thinking about reconfiguring the style and the tone of a summarised retelling to fit with how the story is now, still some humour but an overall serious theme.
Possibly part of the problem is now that people start the story and the way it isn’t to their liking and they never get to the more recent stuff which might be more their thing and give up before that.
I mean, concerning the unicorn, we went from this:
http://www.exiern.com/2005/09/17/wrong-book/
to this:
http://www.exiern.com/2013/11/19/peonie-presumes-part-ii/
(it’s a lot more profound and weighty look at the situation).
Also, I wouldn’t think it would be worth doing on its own but as part of a push to get more readers and especially Patreon donors, combine it with a big advertising push in all the right places.
It’d be a lot like Doctor Who, almost no-one of us are ever going to leap in at the absolute very beginning, everyone picks a start point to go forward from, they always can work backwards later. So have one link with the summarised form in the present style of story telling (more serious) in however many pages to get the basics across (10, 20, 30) and another for everything if they want to go back and look at it.
I guess that’s the other thing, you’d want to hook people in to the story as it’s being told *now* as well, maybe this way would help? Obviously I’m just theorising here as a thought experiment for now.
@Shan
“Retellings” of the art pre-Shipeng have been floated, and they usually break down into two categories;
1) Short summaries that we would include in the beginning of the TPBs (if we ever get final approvals) that cover what came before (although it has also been floated to do this in the Chibiern style).
2) Retelling the entire comic in monthly “issue-sized” chunks for republisher sites such as Comixology, which could even be printed and sold. This is usually toyed with under the title of “Exiern: The Cleave Age.”
Some of this doesn’t get done because I don’t want to appear to be wiping out Exiern’s history – I greatly dislike DC Comic’s various reboots for doing just that (even though the original pages would remain posted). But ultimately, like all things Exiern, much of it has come down to deciding if we want to do that or publish another page of the main story.
But it is a concept I’ve been working on and will probably happen in the future.
@ Scott
Just a theoretical exercise on my part for fun. I would never call for rewriting the past, just a discussion about the benefit of having an additional condensed version as an alternate version to help people jump onboard (it’s a problem I’m having with people I’m recommending it to), like how people get into Doctor as opposed to watching every single surviving episode to the present day (they get the Cliff notes somehow).
It’s not just the amount, it’s just that it’s all a completely different style and tone to the present day. I really like all of it despite its differences (in fact because of its differences).
Anyway, it’s all going to be theoretical (which is why I put it here instead of messaging it to you) for now as even I understand that these things take time and cost money and for now, that’s better spent pushing the existing story forward. It was just a fun exercise for me as to wondering how to do it in conjunction with a plan to get more readers.
I’m amazed no one has picked up on the random ‘bowl’ question…
By the way, anyone else read this webcomic? It’s kind of in the same ballpark as this one (Warning, is adult rated NSFW) and I was wondering what anyone else thought. It’s amazingly well done and I think it really deserves as much support as possible. The art and story are fantastic IMO.
http://eternalknights.thecomicseries.com/
Shoobs: figured that was covered by Archone‘s first post, they do need a fourth to have a proper game
Shan: have been meaning to read that, even more reason now 😉
@ Guesticus
It’s really good. I had to read it several times to work out who was who and what was going on but that’s probably just because I’m stupid (it’s not actually that hard to follow). Also I didn’t mind, it was fun reading it over and over again (picked up more each time) and it’s packed full of detail and excellent characters and dialogue. There’s a 125 pages so far so it hopefully will tide you over until next week.
It’s a shame his Patreon isn’t doing a lot better given the amount of work he puts into it but they told me that due to the content being R-rated (and unavoidably being self declared as NSFW to them), people can only pay Patreon via credit card and not Paypal (Paypal’s terms of service won’t let them). I’m guessing that unavoidably puts a big squeeze on people paying him unfortunately.
@Shan
I read Eternal Knights, and find to hard to follow, which obviously puts me in the ‘stupider than you’ category 😉 but I still read it because the art is fascinating. I particularly love the facial expressions, which the author gets from looking at himself in the mirror (his face must be very malleable).
As for the other topic, I’d prefer the comic to go forward as is, without worrying about the past. I have considered deleting my old work many times, but every time my fans (all three of them) tell me “don’t you dare, deleting them, Dad!” I mean, “Author that is not related to us in any way”!
You already have starting points people can choose if having a four-figure archive is a problem for them. To others, like me, the longer archive is an attraction.
@ Nef
I was never saying delete anything, just have something like a button marked “First 500 pages” or whatever and another saying “Abridged Version (50 pages) then go to etc to continue” for the people who want to both start from a later arc but at least a rundown of what happened before (it’s a bit hard to start Chemiclord’s story without at least a bit of background). Anyway, it’s all hypothetical because it’s not happening anytime soon and I don’t need it as I liked all the early stuff too.
As for Eternal Knights …
I think it’ll help once he has the time and money to colour it. It was designed to be in colour and that really helps when you see the pages he’s already done, it’s easier to pick out detail when it’s not in monochrome.
Yes, I agree it takes at least a bit of work to get through it, the panels are stuffed with detail everywhere but each time I went through it I picked up a bit more (rereading it again right now actually) and the good part is, I actually think it was worth it (certainly beats having to reread something you don’t like).
The characters in it certainly form a very connected web, that also took a bit of time to work out who was connected to whom and how but that was also fun once I got it. Well most of it, there’s still one or two elements I’m not quite sure where they exactly fit.
You’re right about the art, he is good, isn’t he? I certainly would be interested on his take of the characters here.
@Shan and @Nef,
I don’t think your intelligence has anything to do with your difficulty following Eternal Knights. I tried following EK for a while—the artwork for EK is brilliant—but only a short while. It’s simply not worth the effort. The problem is simply that the writing is awful. The plot line is a complete mess, the characters’ motivations make no sense, and the dialogue could have been better written by a nine-year-old. There are just too many good webcomics around to be wasting my time on junk like EK.
Hey all, I never mind people sharing comics links that they think readers will enjoy. And some discussion is also totally cool. However, if we’re going to go too deep or critical into any subject that isn’t Exiern related I’d ask that the conversation move somewhere better suited and related to the topic. Thanks!
I went back to its beginning when I began reading this web comic, as I have done with others I found. it definitely gives a fuller sense of enjoyment to have some basis for moving forward, rather than jumping into the middle and going “huh?” at some turn of events. But most can be figured out sooner or later, even if you do not go back to the beginning. I appreciate that this one is still going. Some have faded away.
What I try not to do- is overthink any web ‘comic’. Unless it truly is setting out to make moral, ethical, political, social or any other purposeful commentary as the main function of its publication, and says so, I just enjoy the story and where it is taking the reader in the universe it built. There is some suspension of reality in all of these.
Why can’t we just enjoy it as it is, without a lot of ruminating on deeper meanings. It may mean something totally different to each person, and to me- that is one of the wonderful things about this genre, and especially this comic. As it has changed and evolved through different creators, it still retains the basic elements it had. It is enjoyable to see the evolution and appreciate what the creative forces behind it have molded.
Okay, fine, maybe Tiff can hold her liquor now.
On the subject of backstory: it would help to have a proper archive page, or maybe a wiki. Something that links to all the comic pages and divides them by story arc.
How do they drink? It looks like they would just be pouring down the neck of their armour, or maybe into the eyeslits of their helmets.
It kinda looks like Bohr is snorting it through his nose in the first panel.
@Eric: If you look closely, you can see their faces in profile, though apparently cloaked in magical shadow. In any case, you can tell that their mouths are accessible for drinking purposes.
@T’Renn: Oh yeah, okay I see it now, in the first panel that is visible for the guy on the right in particular. Still looks like the guy on the left is going to pour it down the front of his armour. 🙂 I think that’s probably either a perspective issue, or the cup was just drawn too low.
It would Seem Tiff got over her previous low alcohol tolerance and no longer can only stomach those “fruity pink things.” About time, honestly.